Why are Fallout fans so toxic? What's your favorite thing about a Fallout game/show that you mostly dislike?

Up until recently, I had no idea there was such a deep divide in the fandom. I played the first two Fallout games in the early 2000s, loved them, and was super excited for Fallout 3, which I generally enjoyed when it was released. Now, I’m playing New Vegas for the first time and absolutely loving it. But whenever I see any video or Reddit thread about the game, I see people either hating on the newer titles, criticizing fans of the originals, or trashing the older games, all presented as undeniable facts. There’s even a recent thread here with top comments criticizing "unhinged" New Vegas fans (who seem to have valid points, from what I can gather). Just recently, I saw an eight-hour video on why Fallout 3 isn’t as good... what?

Interestingly enough, in real life, I’ve never met fans as toxic as those online. Whenever someone mentions Fallout to me in person, it’s always to share how much fun they had playing a particular game. Why can't we be more like Star Wars fans? Sure, I’ve heard plenty of “Disney saved Star Wars” and “the original trilogy is the only good one,” but it never feels as bitter as the Fallout community. It’s usually argumentative (and subjective), but not disjointed angry rants. I mean, entire subreddits had to be created for the Classic Fallout and New Vegas to separate the fanbase. Fallout 1-2 fans, New Vegas fans, and Fallout 3-4 fans aren’t a monolith — there are just people who like or dislike certain aspects of certain games.

Let’s try to make everyone feel accepted and respected when they share their opinions on this franchise we all love. Just because someone says “I don’t like X” doesn’t mean they deserve to be downvoted or hated. We can’t all like the same things. We could be having interesting discussions about how each game portrays the post-apocalypse and what makes each story unique, but instead, it feels like everyone’s bickering like it's politics, picking apart a single quote from one game, and trying to apply it to the entire franchise, which spans nearly three decades and was made by at least three different studios.

To the 3D Fallout fans:

Please understand that the games you're familiar with were built on an existing IP, and it comes with its own fanbase. Bethesda made some retcons (both in terms of style and lore) that the original fans might not appreciate. Yes, some things are not objective truths in a game with multiple endings, but some decisions can seem illogical when compared to the originally established lore. Please don’t attack fans for having a different opinion (even if you think their behavior seems “unhinged” — don’t stoop to their level). Also, please stop saying Bethesda “saved” the franchise. They’re neither the hero nor the villain here; , they just bought a thing and made a thing, that's it — simple as that. PC gaming was niche in the '90s (with only 15-35% of households owning a PC in the US, compared to 81% today), so it's unfair to compare market numbers from then and now. Also, the original Fallout was the second-highest-selling cRPG of 1997. cRPGs may have been niche, but just because Bethesda shifted the IP to a more popular and accessible action-RPG format doesn’t mean they “saved” it.

To fans of the first two games and/or New Vegas:

Please understand that many of the current Fallout fans were introduced to the series with Fallout 3. They love the franchise just like you, but because they started at a different point in its history, they have different expectations. Many will come into the franchise through whatever the latest entry happens to be, and they’ll have different expectations for what it's supposed to be. That doesn’t invalidate your opinion, but it doesn’t make it more valid than theirs.

Yes, I dislike the retcons, and I’m frustrated by how dismissive Bethesda’s management can be about them, but that’s just one small part of a huge work of art. It’s a bit like hating a painting because you don’t like the frame. Doesn’t that seem silly? When you criticize the newer games, sometimes your tone can make it seem like people are wrong for liking them. Please remember that this just upsets people and defeats the point. You're just making people mad at you, not at the actual problem with the game. Think about the last time you liked something that most people hated (maybe Doom 3, Saints Row 4, the new Star Wars movies, or [insert your example here]). Now imagine someone spending eight hours telling you why you’re wrong for liking it. Please, by all means, continue criticizing the games you dislike for their retcons, bad game design, or the shift toward trendy looter-shooter gameplay, but avoid saying things like, "I hate X, Y, and Z, and here’s another reason why Todd Howard should eat shit." It might feel satisfying to say it, but it’s not so fun to read.

Creating something takes a lot of work. We’ve all sat through the end credits of a AAA game at least once, seeing just how many people contribute to its creation. Even if you hate the game, you have to admit that some of those people did a good job. So, what’s your favorite thing about the entry in the franchise that you dislike the most? Here are some of mine:

Fallout 3:

I loved experiencing the wasteland in first person, getting up close to the power armor and seeing all the detail, and the VATS system was a ton of fun. The famous DC monuments turned to rubble were fascinating, the Vault Boy illustrations were really cool. The weapons repair system was a nice touch. And the opening in the Vault was awesome — seeing day-to-day life inside the Vault was amazing. What I appreciate most about the 3D Fallout games is that they allowed us to experience things we couldn’t see because of the isometric perspective and technical limitations. Gameplay aside, the first-person perspective is just more cinematic. Fallout 1 and 2 felt like reading a book, while the 3D games felt more like watching a movie.

Fallout 4:

I absolutely loved the animation for getting into the power armor and seeing how it works from the inside, all the little knobs and levers. The individual quests have always been the strongest part of Bethesda’s games, and there's a particularly cool one where you discover a Chinese submarine with nuclear warheads and soldiers who have been there since the war. I love seeing parts of the bigger game world, felt really odd that in previous games there weren't any ghouls that mentioned their involvement in the war (or at least none that I can remember). Seeing the bombs drop and experiencing pre-war society was pretty cool too.

Fallout 76:

The green, vibrant look of Appalachia is stunning, looks really nice and clean

Fallout TV Show:

The practical props (water chip!), the sets, and the overall aesthetic are fantastic. It was clearly made by people who care for the franchise as a whole when it comes to aesthetics

Be excellent to each other, and long live Fallout!

P.S.: I also want to recommend this amazing video on the subject of divided video game opinions from the late great video game critic TotalBiscuit (RIP legend, the world is poorer for having lost you) called "Stop liking things I don't like - Relativism in games critique"